Fanzine History - Metal Mania and Metal Rendezvous

Legendary photogapher William Hale talked about both fanzines.

So Bill, when and how did you get in touch with Metal music? What made this kind of sound so attractive for you?
Hum, great start Leslie.. I have always been into music, since birth… My Dad always had music on all the time. When I got older and could change the radio station, it was ROCK & ROLL!!! At age six I heard Jimi, Janis, The Doors, The Beatles, The Stones, The Who, Deep Purple's Hush was a biggie… As a teenager in the mid 70's it was Thin Lizzy, Deep Purple, UFO, Status Quo, Aerosmith, BTO, Slade, Sweet, of course, T.Rex, Kiss, Nazareth, a new band called AC/DC… A little bit later some punk slipped in.. The Pistols, The Clash, Nine nine nine,you know that sort… 78-79 brought Lovedrive by Scorpions and Overkill by Motorhead!!! Now these two albums changed EVERYTHING!!! Loverdrive gave all the European bands like Accept, Halloween, Gamma Ray something to shoot for as did Overkill and then Bomber gave the English bands… So naturally all the N.W.O.B.H.M. was to follow and boy did we all jump on that!!!
For how long have you been involved in metal?
That all depends what You call "Metal"… For me "Metal" was some Jimi, some Stepping Wolf, some Cream, some BOC, Purple, Budgie… There was a group in 1975 lead by ex Yardbirds singer Keith Ralph. The band was Armageddon and they where HEAVY!!! But in covering the scene… for the start of the "New Breed" that would be 1980 when MGS played the Oakland Civic center… All that were going to be a major player in the Bay Area scene was at that gig!!! That's the night I met Gary Holt, Paul Baloff, Mike Borden, Dave Starr, Mike Coons and so many others including Cliff Burton!!!
What were the first songs, records, shows etc. that had the biggest effect on you and you decided dedicating your life for the metal scene?
I really think that I was born into this! Just about everything I did leading up to me documenting the Bay Area Scene… As for prime moments… It starts with Hey Joe, the Jimi Hendrix version. I must have been six and heard it on an Am station called "KMBY" in Monterey's Cannery Row… Fast forward to 1979 and Judas Priest - Unleashed in theEast. Gillan - Mr. Universe, Riot - Narita, Electric Sun - Earthquake… 1980 and Budgie - Power Supply, Saxon - Wheels of Steel, the 1st Iron Maiden album!!! Motorhead - Bomber...and all that Neat Records stuff!!!
You were born and growing up in the Bay Area, do you still remember, how did the whole Bay Area metal scene start and develope step by step? How about the early footsteps of the Bay Area scene, with bands such as Metal Church, Anvil Chorus, Blind Illusion, Sinister Savage, Exodus etc.?
You really have to understand that the Bay Area has ALWAYS been a hot bed of bands… The 60's and the 70's bands paved the way for the 80's bands!!! All the clubs were already in place… The promoters like Bill Graham and Bobby Corona (the Stone) were already in place.. And the Bay Area fans were already there as were the older Rock writers, who gave the newer bands press…So it was a matter of time… All the "Metal" bands had a place to gig and fans.. so is was not like "BANG" one day all this stuff just appeared out of thin air...
When it comes to Bay Area metal, Ron Quintana and Ian Kallen are one of the founding fathers, how do you view it? Does it also mean, that they were big catalysators of what later was becoming the famous Bay Area scene?
Ron flew the "flag" but was not the leader… The scene has many "players" and all have there place… The club bookers had a ton of stuff to do with all this… If they don't book your band then… and the independent record store owners who took a chance on stocking the import vinyl which fueled the fire had a ton of stuff to do with the scene… Jeff Weller, the managers of Laaz Rockit, had a big impact… Jeff brought Metal Bands from LA to San Francisco… Mike Varney (Shrapnel Records) had a ton of influence… Metal Mania did not cover a lot of the Bay Area shows… Ron was partial to Motorhead, The Scorpions, Yngwie and Anvil Chorus..
Ron is the man, the myth, the legend, have supported the Bay area metal scene since 1981 when he founded a renegade radio show called Rampage Radio, he was the first Bay Area metal DJ to promote underground bands through his radio show on KUSF and as the editor of the Metal Mania fanzine, how did the whole Metal Mania and KUSF start exactly?
A couple of key points about KUSF… KUSF is the University of San Francisco radio station, it started in 1961… When Ron started there You could only get the signal if you were in a 5 to 10 block radius… It looks cool on paper… but a lot of "young college" people started to play "Metal"... Stred co hosted a radio program in Monterey and there was few others…
Was the whole metal scene in its infancy at this point?
Yeah, this could be said…
Do you agree with, that it wasn’t anything until Metallica’s relocation to the East Bay Area? I mean, did the scene start and get bigger after Metallica relocate to the Bay Area?
Ha, there will be a ton of bands after You for that Statement!!! The scene was why Metallica moved from LA… The Bay area was in full metal swing when Lars and James moved in!!! There were so many metal bands!! not just Thrash… please remember Metallica were "Speed Metal" until Xavier Russell coined the phrase "Thrash Metal"… Vicious Rumors, Steele, Griffin, Hexx, Winterhawk, Brocas Helm, Trauma, Overdrive, Laaz Rockit, Tyrant even Death Angel had started…
So, they seemed to be very influential for the whole scene, right?
Metallica only played five official gigs before they left for New York and three of those show where when they were still based in LA… In all truth.. Lemmy had a bigger impact on all of Us, even Metallica!!! But most of the bigger bands were already formed and gigging...
You became the photographer of Metal Mania, how and when did you join them? Did you also do interview, write reviews and stuff?
I was trying to get my mag off the ground and Ron would ask for pics… since MRV was not out yet I gave him some photos in hopes by doing that I would get interest for my mag...
Did the staff consist of Ron, Ian and you or were there other members too?
Yes Metal Mania was Ron and a gang of correspondents and pen pals… Lots of young writers had articles in MM… Bob Naldandian wrote the 1st Metallica piece, Bernard Doe, K.J. Doughton, Harald O, Brain Lew (Whiplash) and Tim Kort just to name a few…
Do you still remember, how did you get acquainted with each other? Did you have a common musical interest and taste?
Yeah Ron was just like John Strednansky (Chief Editor Metal Rendez-vous Int.) and I… We all were "Up" on the rock scene world wide!!! We hung out at all of the same clubs and dug all of the same bands, and yes we are the same age... I think that Ron and I are a month apart!!!
One of Ron’s more notable moment in metal history is when he asked a not-so-famous friend of his, Lars Ulrich, to help him pick a name for his new fanzine, Lars looked the list over, spied the name Metallica and told Ron to call the fanzine Metal Mania, is that correct?
Yeppa that's about how that story went… Funny, I do not know if Lars and Quintana knew about the book "Encyclopedia Metallica" which predates this event by a year or so…
Were you aware of, that by the mid-1960s, several fans active in science fiction and comics fandom recognized a shared interest in rock music, and the rock fanzines were born and Paul Williams and Greg Shaw were two such SF-fans turned rock zine editors?
Hum… no I did not???
Are Williams’ „Crawdaddy!” (1966) and Shaw’s two California-based zines, „Mojo Navigator” (full title, „Mojo-Navigator Rock and Roll News”) (1966) and „Who Put the Bomp?” (1970) among the most important early rock fanzines? Did you know these fanzines at all?
I never read these but was somewhat aware of them… We or at least I was really into Joel Selvin the music editor of the San Francisco Chronicle… He covered the Bay Area scene forever!!! But mainly we were into the British press.. Mick Wall, Malcolm Dome, Paul Suter and the MIGHTY Geoff Barton!!!
Did you know, that „Crawdaddy!” quickly moved from its fanzine roots to become one of the first rock music „prozines” with paid advertisers and newsstand distribution, while „Bomp” remained a fanzine, featuring many writers who would later become prominent music journalists, including Lester Bangs, Greil Marcus, Ken Barnes, Ed Ward, Dave Marsh, Mike Saunders and R. Meltzer?
No I did not… But this goes to show that You have to start somewhere!!!
Bomp was not alone; an August 1970 issue of Rolling Stone included an article about the explosion of rock fanzines: other rock fanzines of this period include „Flash” 1972, edited by Mark Shipper, „Eurock Magazine” (1973-1993) edited by Archie Patterson and Bam Balam, written and published by Brian Hogg in East Lothian, Scotland, beginning in 1974, and in the mid-1970s, Back Door Man and denim delinquent, so would you name it the start and the turning point of the underground scene?
For Stred and I, we started MRV because no US mainstream mag was keeping up with what the English press was doing!!! When we got MRV off the ground it was to cover all the bands that we were into and not what "Corporate America" was paying for… (Side note to history… Metal Rendez-vous was up to 100,000 issues… Metal Hammer, today is only 50,000 and Metal Mania never did those numbers…)
Metallica went on to become a household name and Metal Mania became a staple in the underground, introducing metal fans to unsigned bands across the country, as well as exposing them to a large dose of punk, hardcore, and New Wave Of British Heavy Metal, does it mean, that Metal Mania became the very first heavy metal fanzine in the States?
Well, Leslie, Brian Slagel had the 1st fanzine. It was called the New Heavy Metal Review and I think this was 1980… BUT it was really Sounds and Kerrang that made a bigger impact!!!
The early Bay Area bands (including Metallica too) were highly influenced by the NWOBHM, that started at the late ’70s/early ’80s, were you aware of the existence of that scene? From where did you get informations, news etc. about what’s going on in Europe?
YES!!! WE ALL LOVED THE N.W.O.B.H.M.!!! Sounds, and to a leaser extent, NME and Melody Maker brought it all to Us!!!Then of course Kerrang Topped them all!!!
You mentioned above, that a gang of correspondents and pen pals including Bernard Doe wrote for MM, is he the guy, who established Metal Forces later on?
Yeah, one and the same... lots of pen pals became major writers in their own right...
Was it easy for you guys to get the new Iron Maiden, Diamond Head, Judas Priest, Motörhead etc. records or tapes? Were all of you fans of that legendary NWOBHM movement?
Yes, Leslie, The NWOBHM was HUGE for Us... We all scoured all the record stores for all the latest imports... Ron even worked at The Record Vault at one point...
At this point in Germany started a big metal boom as well, with acts, such as Accept, Scorpions, Grave Digger, Stormwitch, Steeler etc., were you familiar with the bands too?
Yes. The Scorpions were the first... Stred was in to them way back in the mid 70's... But we were into the other 70's German bands like Lucifer's Friend, Night Sun, Epitaph, Guru Guru, Birth Control and Jane... Then came Accept. Warlock, Holy Moses and the others...
How do you view, that along with Tampa, Florida, New York and Los Angeles the Bay Area scene was widely attributed as a starting point of American thrash metal?
San Francisco had the club scene already and it was a very large one... That's why the Bay Area ruled... The Clubs were there and great clubs they were!!!
Do you agree with, that as different thrash metal scenes began to develop starting around the early/mid-80's each had their own distinct sound that differentiated the bands from other bands on the scene?
Yeah, it's a geo-political, sociological aspect of life... Bands need some thing to sing about... Guitar tones come from the street... If you live in a house with a basement... Bands seemed to be more complex... If a band lives in the inter city, they tend to be more raw and "punkish"... Anthrax, Overkill and Hades all have that NYC punk edge, as the early Metallica and Megadeth were more complex...
The scene’s earliest bands like Exodus, Metallica, perhaps best examplified the early straight up NWOBHM meets punk style of the scene and albums that very much highlighted this era of Bay Area thrash included Metallica’s „Kill Em All” and Exodus’s „Bonded By Blood”, right?
Well, they were not the 1st bands, per se… Bands like Steel, Laas Rockit and Vicious Rumors had it going on way before... Please remember that Metallica had all, but two, songs written in LA before they moved and Exodus' 1st album came out late in 85... The Bay area was pumping way before then...
Would you say, that Slayer’s „Show no mercy” had also a very important effect on the developing of the American thrash scene?
I would say Riot's "Fire Down Under"... First because it came out in 1981 and the controversy around the album... secondly everyone got it and played it to death... It may not be "THRASH" by definition, but very very influential.. Just play the title track!!! Slayer was big, but there were others...
In your opinion, were there any borders between the styles (black, thrash, death etc.) back in the day or was it a common underground scene? Would you say, that the rise of the extreme metal began with acts, such as Mantas/Death, Massacre, Possessed, Slaughter, Death Strike/Master etc.?
The whole thing was great, until it got to be a parody of it self...
Were you familiar with fanzines such as Decibel Of Death, Kick Ass Monthly, Violent Noize, Blackthorn etc.? Were there any fanzines there were a kind of examples for you how has a fanzine to do? I mean, which fanzines have had the biggest influence, effect on you? Which papers did you know or like back then?
I knew of a few,BUT it was Sounds, NME and the Melody Maker that did it for us... I think that the "Major Rock mags here did more for us in what they would not print... This made all of us work harder to cover "Our Music"... My mag Metal Rendezvous came out just after Ron's 1st issue..
Did you have enough material for each issues? Were there any materials that left out?
Yes, there were a ton of bands... and No, I do not recall the bands that we did not cover.. way too many years have gone by..
What were the criterias for choosing the bands to feature in Metal Mania?
Any band that rocked!!!
Were you concentrating on supporting the underground scene?
Yes... But you had to balance the coverage...
Did you often get demos and rehearsals from underground groups?
ALL THE TIME!!! and from all around the world...
Were you aware of the newer bands via flyers or…?
Yeah, bands would give ya flyers all of the time… and demo tapes and free tickets to their gigs...
How did you do the issues of the fanzines and how much did take to do each issues?
We'd get together and just start hashing out the layouts... I would size all my pix and Stred started to type away...
Did you do the issues with typewriter? What about the production of the fanzines as a whole?
We learned as we went along and made it up when we could...
What were the early issues like and how were the responses to them? How many copies did you print and was it hard to get rid of them?
The 1st issue was xeroxed at a print shop... I photocopied the next few at my Moms office and finally we were professionally off set printed!
Did you also try to get in touch with labels as well? Do you still remember what were the labels that you got in touch with?
Yeppa, out of all of the "fanzines" We got to be the Major Labels' favorite!!! We really did our best to be professional...
Did they start sending you promos? On what kind of format did you get the advance or promotional stuffs?
Yeppa, our mail box was stuffed full of promos...
How many copies of all these single issues were sold at all? How many copies are/were printed from each issue?
I think issue #1 was a run of 50... Our last few issues ran 100,000 copies world wide!!!
What do the issues cost back then? Did you also change, trade with other fanzine editors?
$1.50 for the 1st ones and $2.00 or $3.00 at the end... here is a link to a Facebook Gallery I have set up for some of the covers.
How did you distribute, spread the fanzines? Were you in connection with penbangers from all over the world?
Yeah, Pen pals and record shops...
What about the promotion of Metal Mania back then? How and how much promotion did you make for Metal Mania? I mean, did you sell it alone or was it available at shows, record stores etc.?
Not much promo going on… I think Ron really did not get into that "Sales Man" vibe. But at MRV we did a lot of cross promotions with Bands and record labels… Stred was king of all that!
Did you send from the paper to those bands, which were interviewed in the fanzine?
We tried to send all of the bands copies but fell short… So, sorry guys!
As for the ’80s, both the tape trading scene and running fanzines were very popular, they were at their peak those times, would say, that running fanzines was a chain reaction back then? I mean, the editors draw inspiration from each other or…?
Not really… Stred and I just wanted to put out the best metal mag ever!!! We had our own style but I saw a lot of copy cats out there… but none of them lasted long...
Was a competition between the fanzines editors or was a unity among them? With which fanzine editors were you in touch back then? Which fanzine was the best back in the day in your opinion?
Not really… At MRV we were way too bizzy and I could say the same of Ron… We were like the 1st…
Do you think that fanzines played, play and will play an important role in the Metal scene? How can mags/’zines support the career of bands?
Yeah back then before the internet… Print was king!!! Now I really have not seen the internet "Break" a band yet… But, it helps some bands along the way.
As fanzines were produced in ever greater volumes and developed into new areas of subject matter, a form of culture also developed around them, a "fanzine scene" is referred to by zine producers, do you agree with it?
I really don't know how to answer that one… I was way too busy to step back and look at what we did… I went to a gig, shot the band backstage, shot some live pix and then hang out after… then drive back to Monterey get some sleep and processes the film and make some test prints and head down to the office and layout meetings… Then get back to my darkroom and make master prints to send off to the printers… We never really looked at this as anything else but getting the Metal news out...
What do you think about, that a major problem that fanzines have is their seclusion and isolation away from the general public?
No, the major problem with most 'zines were that they were run by people that did not know what they were doing and did not know METAL… MRV lasted of ten years or so and was up to 100,000 issues!!!
Back to a little bit to Bay Area, the scene started changing in the mid ’80s, more and more thrash bands appeared, but Possessed would bring a turning point to the genre with 1985’s „Seven Churches” regarded as the first album to cross over from thrash metal to death metal for the largely "growling vocals" and subject matter dealing with horror and the occult, how do you explain this?
Don't know about that… You should ask Tom from Slayer that…. Slayer was 1st and all the rest were incomparable!
As I mentioned above, around the mid-80's the sound of the scene changed considerably; virtuosic musicianship (particularly lead guitars) had become a defining characteristic of the scene, correct?
Don't know about that either… Yngwie has always been Yngwie as well as Mustiane being Mustaine so I would say Metal always was about great playing...
The second wave of bands coming out of the scene, led by Testament, Death Angel, Forbidden, and Heathen, played a style of thrash considerably different from their predecessors; this new brand of thrash featured longer and more harmonically and rhythmically complex songs, with often neo-classical styled dual lead guitar playing highlighting the album…
Heathen had Doug from Anvil Chours, that band was all about dual guitars… The Bay area was really all about great playing… Vicious Rumors and Laaz Rockit were main stays…They set the "pace" as much as Exodus and Metallica…
Would you say, that the songs also borrowed more from NWOBHM vocals and melodies?
Any Diamond Head tunes… But Motorhead was and still is the band that set the bar for all to aim for… Cheers Lemmy!!!
A progressive rock influence became apparent for the first time in the genre and the punk influence that was once crucial to the genre was now almost completely absent and this sound, highlighted by albums like Testament’s „The Legacy” and Death Angel’s „The Ultra-Violence”, both released in 1987, was the style that many would associate with the classic Bay Area sound, what are your views on it?
If Cliff was still here he would have something to say about that… The 2nd Metallica album was all that, but the bay area had bands like Griffin and Dammaj that were playing that way long before those bands… Funny, how some bands stay and others fade…
This is often attributed to the fact that guitar virtuoso Joe Satriani lived in the Bay Area and often instructed a number of guitarists who would go on to play in some of these bands (some of these guitarists would include Exodus’s Rick Hunolt, Testament’s Alex Skolnick, and Metallica’s Kirk Hammett), do you agree with that statement? Did Such really a help a lot those guitarists becoming better and more professional?
WOW… Don't say that to Mike Varney… His U.S. Metal lp's did way more than Joe did!
So Bill, how long did you work for Metal Mania? How would you sum up the years that you sent by Metal Mania?
Not long… But, I always there for Ron when he needed some pix
What made you to join Metal Rendezvous? Did you part ways on a friendly term at the end? Did you remain in touch with Ron and Ian after you left Metal Mania?
MRV was started by John Strednansky and myself… Ron got MM out 1st but Stred and I took a little longer to find our design… I still talk to Ron, email mostly, due to the fact that I now live in Hawaii… We did a podcast last year and Ron wrote a cool bit for my Metallica photo book…
After twenty years on the air and through myriad fanzines, Ron continues to promote the local metal scene and introduce new music to his legions of fans. It means, he is still enthusiastic, metal is his passion and metal runs in his veins, right?
Ron has more of a wide taste now a days… But he still is Ron… God bless him for that!!!
To which extent were you familiar with Metal Rendezvous? Did they already exist at this point or was it a really new mag/’zine?
No, we started out as a fanzine and grew up… Stred and I saw a place for a great US Metal mag.. We were big with all the record labels so we needed to be more professional, but we still ROCKED!!!
They were based in California, correct?
Monterey, the same place that Jimi and The Who made there US debuts...
As for the musical taste of this paper, did they specialize in thrash metal or simply in metal in general?
We were Hard Rock and Heavy Metal BUT I NEVER LIKED LABELS… IT WAS REALLY ALL THE SAME...
What about the staff of MR? Did you become photographer like by Metal Mania?
Well, I was one of the founders. Stred wrote and I snapped away… Come to think about it John and I were the only writer & photog team out there...
How many issues were released from MR during the years? How would you describe each issues? How often was MR released?
We lasted 10 years and at 1st our output was not that great but after 87 we were like every 2 months...
Did it succeed for the mag in doing a name for themselves or influencing other ’zine writers? I mean, do you consider an influential and successful mag?
We wanted to write about the bands we liked! If other writers like it that was cool, but we really were there to push the music.. The funny thing was, that a lot of big mags did stories on MRV… From Rolling Stone, Kerrang and even High Times all wrote stories on MRV… So to answer that question yes, but I really did not care. We were there for the MUSIC!!!
When and why did stop MR its activities? Did you relocate to Honolulu Hawaii, after MR was off?
Stred and I put MRV to "sleep" in December 1989… I was living in LA and was just tired… Really, for the last ten years I photographed bands up and down California. If not the rest of the US… I WAS WIPED OUT… I was the one who had to go out and deal with bands… Hell, most of the writers just picked up the phone… I had to be there in the clubs…I slept for two years before I started to hang out again… I moved here, to Hawaii, almost ten years ago and I still work with bands… The main one is Henry Kapono. Henry put out a cd called "The Wild Hawaiian" just think if Jimi Hendrix grew up hawaiian and that's what you got!!!
Since you are in the scene since 1979, how much did change the music industry compared to the late ’70s/early ’80s? What do you think about the present metal scene as a whole? What are the bands that you prefer or often listen to these days?
The whole monster has changed!!! That's a good thing, record labels got greedy! Fat and Greedy… They charged far to much for cds when they cost less to make… I could go on but why… Now bands, if they smart and know how to take advantage of the "Steve Jobs" revolution can do it all them selves.. Really, bands should know the BIZ, all the ins and outs. Recording, legal, marketing and promotion… their are so many outlets to get your music out to the fans… Bands who do the leg work will be the next stars.. BUT remember it is a business and needs to be treated as such!!!
Are you for or against the file-sharing and mp3 things?
Let me put it this way… I always put a © on all my pix that I put up on the net… So if people want to use them you will see my copyright. I do not mind if someone reposts my work as I know others will see my name on them.. If someone takes the extra time to photoshop my name off.. they have way too much time on their hands...
What are your future plans?
To get out my next photo book.. Megadeth: Another Time - A Different Place... I'm in talks right now…
Please name your first ten all time classics! Please add your comments to them!
WOW!!! that's so hard to do but here it goes…
Scorpoins - Loverdrive
This album ushered in a big change in metal… recorded and released in 1979 great guitars, great production just listen to this over headphones and let the brothers Schenker make you a believer!!!

Motorhead - Ace of Spades
Lemmy and company where on a roll with Overkill and Bomber, this would be the crowning maters piece that would bring America to it's "Motor-Headbangers" to their feet and rise their "Iron Fist"!!!

UFO - Strangers in the night
I'm going with the live album because it contains all UFO's cool track up to than… Schenker or Paul Chapman.. who knows and who cares this just cooks up some great guitar licks!!!

Gillan - Mr. Universe
Yeah over Deep Purple!!! Ya'll need to go find this record!!! Ian really pulled this out from his heavy roots… The right place and the right time…
Mr. Universe just rules!!!

Deep Purple - Made in Japan
Purple is my favorite band!!! It's hard to pick out just one album for a group that has had some many line up changes… But Made in Japan is a great sound live effort that show cases Ritchie's Guitars and Ian's voices!!!
Highway star anyone????

Riot - Fire Down Under
This is America's first true Metal album!!! Mark Reale and the band went through hell to get this released as Capitol records said that this was too heavy… Capital's loss and Our gain!!!

Holocaust - The Nightcomers
Yeah over Maiden, Angel Witch and Saxon… This record really captures the feel of The New Wave of British Heavy Metal!! Yeah go out and find it and you will see what and talking about!!!

Metallica - Masters of Puppets
Cliff finest hour… RIP Buddy!!!

Megadeth - Killing is my business
One word "Rattlehead" =)

Y&T - Earthshaker
The Band Area's big brothers of hard Rock!!! When Dave and crew signed a new deal with A&M records their 1st record was Earthshaker and the Rock world was never the same… Almost every California based band opened for Y&T… Van Halen, Motely and yes even Metallica...

Bill, thanks a lot for the interview, any closing words for my readers?
And thank you for the time and cheers for help keeping the Metal flame burning!!! If You dig this type of music, go out and support it, Buy the cds, go to the gigs, find new bands the rule and help push them… Metal is a true fan driven music!!! It's up to all of us to help keep metal in the forefront.
Cheers and Aloha =)

Crowbar - Kirk Windstein

The interview was done in Summer before Crowbar's show. Credit and thanks to my friend Viktor Tauszik the singer of Hungarian band Nadir.


What is it like to celebrate the 4th of July on a European tour if you celebrate it at all?
Kirk Windstein: I don't. I put on Facebook “Happy 4th of July to my American friends” and when I'm home I'm going to have “Barbecue day” and “Baseball Day”.
You have been to Europe in April as well, and you celebrated your birthday with Sepultura in Germany.
Kirk: Yes. It was great because Andreas (Kisser) said: „Hey man, do you wanna play Orgasmatron by Motörhead?” And I said: “Yeah, of course.” The only thing that sucked with that was that Peter Steele died. On my birthday!..
When can we expect the new Crowbar album to come out?
Kirk: It's all written. It's a matter of getting the time to do it. When I get home I will have nine days total which I want to spend with my daughter and my finance as much as possible. Then I'm back to London with Down. It's going so busy... We finally signed a deal with E1 in America and Century Media for the rest of the world with Crowbar. That's a good big label. We'll also have a brand new live album with a couple of new studio tracks on Housecore Records which will re-release some old Crowbar shit. It's a very small label but it's good. It's run by Phil (Anselmo), he's in charge which makes it good because you know that anything that comes out is going be underground. It's an underground label. It's going to be underground, it's going to be good quality shit, something he likes.
When you started playing music, one of your first bands was Wrequiem. How did Crowbar developed from it?
Kirk: Wrequiem was basically Crowbar. First we changed the name to The Slugs, then to Crowbar but we played the same songs.
Why did you change the band name?
Kirk: We started calling ourselves The Slugs, the we got a small record deal with an underground label. They said: “Look, there is already a band out there called the The Slugs, so can you call your band another name?” And I said: “sure.” Actually, I was playing in a band called Crowbar. I played drums, Jimmy (Bower) played guitar, Sexy T played bass and we had this big, really dark skin black guy singing. It was his anti Skrewdriver band with a “fuck racism, I hate everybody” attitude.
What is happening with those other New Orleans based bands you started with at the same time or which came shortly after Crowbar, e.g. Graveyard Rodeo, Stressball, Tungsten?
Kirk: None of them exist anymore. We're still friends with some of the guys but none of those bands exist.
And what is new on the New Orleans scene?
Kirk: Honestly, I don't know. I'm 45 years old, I don't go out that much and I'm not part of the scene anymore. It's not that I'm a dick about this but I don't have time. I have my routine, I have my lady, I cut the grass, I clean the house, I go to the grocer... I'm a regular guy. But I don't go to shows that much anymore.
Do you know anything about Sexy T? What is he doing currently?
Kirk: We spoke a couple of times recently, for the first time in like ten years and he's doing well. He had a stomach surgery and lost weight which is good. He's kind of happy away from it. He couldn't smoke pot, he couldn't drink beer, he got bored with it. When things were actually on the up for Crowbar, it was fantastic but he really had no money for us, so he said he will get married and work a regular job. And I said: “Dude, I respect you for that”. So, he's doing well.
Back then, you had lots of different projects with former Crowbar members, Phil Anselmo and nearly all musicians from the New Orleans metal scene, e.g. Christ Inversion, Both Legs Broken...
Kirk: Yes but nowadays my day is full with other businesses... Just being a husband and a father, enjoying life at 45.
You are going to play Ozzfest in the US with Kingdom Of Sorrow. Any chance to do a European tour?
Kirk: Yeah, we'll do it at some point. Down is my main priority and Crowbar is right behind it now.
What was it like to work with Jamey? What kind of person is he?
Kirk: He's a great businessman and a fucking Nazi slave driver. He makes the best out of it, that's how you have to work with him. I'm all laid back and he's like “Hurry up, hurry up!..” It was great, though.
You have an official Crowbar web site. Do you still find it important to keep a web site while Myspace and Facebook are more popular than anything else?
Kirk: I'm on Facebook more. I just tell people what is going on, where I am, what was the show like, how I miss my girl and my daughter. But I don't really fuck with it much.
Of course, your fiancee and your daughter miss you a lot, too. Isn't it a problem for them that you are not as often home as you're supposed to be?
Kirk: They understand it. They don't like it but it's a fact of life. This is what I do. It sucks for me because the only time I really enjoy touring is when I'm on stage and that's only one hour. So, the rest of the day is missing my beautiful fiancee, my daughter, my friends... It's another hotel and a different place every day...
What is the thing that still keeps you inspired after all these years?
Kirk: For me, it's the same thing from the start: when I hear a fucking guitar riff, my dick gets up. Ever since I was a kid. The thing that inspires me and makes me carry on is the fact that I love writing music, playing music, performing music and I realize how blessed and fortunate I am to be able to. I don't have any friends that can say that they opened for AC/DC in Romania or fuckin' rode the same plane with Ronnie James Dio. I feel very blessed for that and I'm very thankful.

http://www.crowbarmusic.com/
http://www.myspace.com/crowbar

Insanity - Dave Gorsuch

This interview isn't a new one, because it have been done for several years ago, but I think, it didn't loose its actuality.

Dave, I would curious to know, how did you discover metal and what did you find so exciting in this music? At which point did you find interest in music and metal in particular?
When I first got into music I started listening to bands like Black Sabbath, Rush, Led Zeppelin etc. Joe DeZuniga exposed me to metal which I loved from the start because I always was into the heaviest and most technical riffs from the bands I was exposed to.
Were you always the fan of thrash what was going on in the Bay Area or were you rather into classic metal acts, such as IRON MAIDEN, JUDAS PRIEST, SAXON etc. or perhaps into melodic ones, such as KISS, VAN HALEN, DEF LEPPARD etc.?
Since we met in the early 80's bands like Motorhead, Iron Maiden, Judas Priest etc. was the heaviest shit we could find which were our favorite bands until we discovered Venom & Mercyful Fate among others. We were really into the scene and saw Metallica play with Dave Mustaine and Ron McGovney in 1982 and they became our favorite band until we saw Slayer the first time they came up from L.A.
When did you decide to play guitar and was this the first instrument that you you've decided to play? How did your choice fall on guitar at all?
I just really loved it from the start. I remember listening to AC/DC when I first got into music as a kid and I was thrashing all around the house playing air guitar with a broom, jumping off the furniture and totally rocking out. Besides the fast and intense parts, guitar solos were often my favorite parts of songs so naturally I wanted to be a lead guitarist.
What were your influences to become a metal musician?
First I guess it was Maiden, Preist, Motorhead, Venom and Mercyful Fate then Metallica and Slayer, I was always heavily into Randy Rhoads as well.
At that time was the great thrash buzz at the Bay Area, such bands popped out, like EXODUS, POSSESSED, DEATH ANGEL, HEATHEN, BLIND ILLUSION, TRAUMA etc. what can you tell us about those extraordinary early years, about the atmosphere that could be found in that area, the violence that could be found at the EXODUS shows etc…
Those were THE BEST TIMES. It was so cool in those early years before Metallica got big because the punk scene fused with the metal scene and everyone was thrashing all around like a big group of friends slamming into each other like you would with a small group of friends. Everyone was open minded as well. At our very first show we had a huge violent pit within 30 seconds of starting the first song and no one even heard of us before.
The Bay Area scene was becoming very big with the aforementioned acts and all of them tried to make their dent in the scene, how did you view that explosion?
It was great, we'd go see bands like Possessed, Exodus and Death Angel all the time and having the scene get bigger helped us out when we started playing live.
Were you familiar with those outfits?
Sure we'd see them all the time and partied with a few, especially our bros in Possessed.
In my opinion the most extreme and aggressive band at the Bay Area was POSSESSED, do you agree with me? Would you name POSSESSED thrash, death or black metal band?
I would agree, I think Possessed was the first death metal band. I believe even Chuck of Death said in the past „Seven Churches" was the first real death metal album.
Were there at that time borders between the styles of metal (thrash, speed, death etc.) or was there a common underground, extreme metal scene?
There weren't "borders" just because people had different styles. At that time there weren't that many bands around that were death so it was more of a common scene. Athough when we started playing in the Bay Area, Possessed was the only other local death metal band which is probably why we bonded and liked to hang out with them at shows.
The band was formed in 1985 by vocalist/guitarist Joe DeZuniga and you, did you know ach other earlier? Did you have previous experiences or was INSANITY your very first band?
Yeah we were friends a few years before Insanity started. Joe actually taught me some of my first riffs on guitar when we were best friends at 15 & 16.
At which point did bassist Keith Ellison and drummer Bud Mills get in the picture exactly? What about their musical past?
Keith was my good friend and bassist. After we had been jamming for a while and started to write a little bit, we joined with Joe after playing our high school in January of '85 we spent the summer playing with a different drummer Joe knew but that didn't work out and Bud answered an ad we had at the local record store where we'd go to buy the latest metal albums.
Were they your first choices or were there perhaps auditioned other musicians as well? Was it easy to find members that were sharing the same musical interest?
Keith and Joe were my first choices, once we formed we played our high school with both the drummer we had and a drummer Joe played with but once we found Bud we knew he was the man.
I read on your biography, Keith Ellison played bass like the death metal version of Steve Harris, was Steve his pattern?
Yeah Steve Harris was his main influence I believe. He was an amazing musician and ripped it up like a lead guitarist on bass at times.
Joe DeZuniga roared out some of the most brutal death metal vocals of that time and he was also one of the main songwriters and the artist that created the logo with the decapitated heads, is that correct?
That is correct, he was an amazing artist. I used to draw myself but I gave it up and just starting playing guitar when I met him and realized I couldn't draw for shit compared to him.
Who came up with the name of the band? Was it an original choice as far as the name of the band?
That was Joe's name. Keith the bassist and I had another name and Joe actually joined us to play a show at our high school. He would draw the logo and the beast creature on shirts and Gary Holt of Exodus wore one live so we said o.k. Joe we'll call the band Insanity.
I mean, in the middle '80's were there bands in Germany, Norway and Singapore who called INSANITY, didn't the fans confuse the bands with each other?
That is news to me, we never heard of them. We had a ton of mail coming in from around the world and we were in a bunch of fanzines as well so I guess you would have to ask the fans that question.
Was it clear for you right from the start to found a death metal band? Was death metal a known notion (term) at that time?
I believe it was just starting to be called death metal after Possessed released the first album Seven Churches. We aimed to write songs that were heavier, faster, and more technical than anything we heard people playing.
Was your goal to become the most brutal Bay Area act?
You could say that. We wanted to try to take things to new extremes in speed, heaviness and technical intensity.
Would you say that the first really death metal group was INSANITY in the Bay Area? Were you the forerunners of death metal?
Well Bud did come up with the drumbeat that took the speed of our music past the barriers of the thrash beat so I guess you could say that as far as the evolution of what death metal has become.
At that time was in Florida an active death metal scene with likes such as MORBID ANGEL, MASSACRE, MANTAS, HELLWITCH etc., were you familiar with them? Have you heard of them at that time? Did these bands have had an impact on you?
Yes they were a lot of the early fanzines we were in so we did hear of them but we had already established our sound so none of them had an impact on Insanity music.
What about the rehearsals of INSANITY? How do you remember about them?
The early days were some of the best times of my life. We had so much fun playing and partying back then. We used to jam in my garage and then get really drunk sometimes there was a bunch of people around thrashing and going wild. My parents would be really pissed at the condition of the house when they got home although they were very supportive, especially when mail starting coming in from around the world.
Do you consider yourselves as talented musicians?
Not the rest of the band but I am! Haha! Actually there were some good musicians around but we tried to write songs that went just beyond our ability at first which in turn made us better.
Did you rehearse hard to become better musicians?
We would try to rehearse up to five days a week when we first got Bud but that's because we had fun and were inspired, I wouldn't call it hard especially they way we partied back then.
Did you try to improve your abilities as far as playing music?
We had to improve our abilities to be able to play the riffs we started writing. Often we would teach each other riffs, we would have to wait a week or so before we all had them down good enough to be able to play the songs with the whole band up to speed.
Did you start writing own material right from the start or did you jam some classics of METALLICA, SLAYER, EXODUS etc.?
For our first show at our high school we played the standard "Seek and Destroy" and "No Remorse" from Metallica as well as "Black Magic" and "Fight Till Death" from Slayer. Black Magic was the first song we played with Bud when he came to audition and he did it perfectly so we knew we had the right guy. From then on we concentrated on original music only.
Was it hard to aquire playing the covers? Did you consider difficult to play the covers?
Not really although the first Metallica solos I learned with the help of a guitar teacher since I just started playing guitar a little more than 2 years before Insanity formed.
The first show was played on October 19th 1985 with DEATH and SACRILEGE and the crowd maintained a frenzied pit which was admittedly short because the band only had five songs at the time, any memories of this gig? Were you very exciting before the show?
That was probably the best experience I've had being on stage (although Murderfest last year was pretty cool too!) It was unbelievable how people that never heard of us before would be thrashing that hard and stage diving. At one point there were about seven or eight people that did a stage dive at once at the almost took Joe off the stage with them.
What about the setlist? Which own songs respectively which covers did you play on that night?
I don't remember the specific order after starting with Attack of Archangels but the first three songs we had down were Fire Death Fate, Blood For Blood and Ultimate Death which were on the '85 demo. Death After Death and Attack (which had instrumental versions sometimes included on the '85 demo) were next after that.
Wasn't it risky to play a show without having a demo tape?
I don't think so, Mike Torrao from Possessed put in a good word for us and Wes from Ruthies Inn was mellow so it was nice to be able to play with bands like Death and Sacrilege for our first show.
INSANITY then went on to play with many of the other great bands that played Ruthies Inn including the likes of POSSESSED, I think so it could have been a great gig, the two most brutal Bay Area bands on stage on the same night, how do you see it?
Yeah that was a great show and they were good friends of ours and Mike T. really helped us get going before we were even sure if we were ready to play live.
Meanwhile a live rehearsal tape that was recorded with a stereo microphone was being circulated and an underground following was growing in countries around the world, didn't you have the opportunity to record the material in a studio?
Not at that time, we didn't have any money and some of the reviewers were writing that it sounded better than most studios demos anyway. We were planning on recording in the studio in '86 but that's when Bud got thrown in jail and later that year was when Joe first got sick.
What about the recording sessions?
We'll after recording the band live the way we'd normally set up, I made some adjustments for the recording that became 85 demo. I had Bud set up his drums in the center of the garage. Then I'd set the recording level to his playing and then match the level with the amp volumes which were set up by the sides of the garage door like usual. We plugged Joe's mic into my practice amp and I leaned it back against Bud's front most cymbal stand aimed at the bottom of the mic.
The demo contains originally three tracks, featuring „Fire, death fate", „Ultimate death" and „Blood for blood", but on some versions are „Attack of archangels" and „Death after death", why didn't you put these tracks on the demo? Was the five track tape a bootleg version?
It was only our 3rd or 4th rehearsal I think and Joe didn't have the vocals down yet (and we didn't have the leads down either).
Were you satisfied with the end result, with the sound of the tape?
Yes I am.
Would you say, if you could have recorded the demo in a studio would it have sounded better?
Sure but only if we had the right engineer or producer that would make it sound as raw and powerful. The 85 demo captured the essence of Insanity pretty well and as a lot of early reviews said, it sounded better than a lot of studio demos at the time.
About 1986 the underground scene was really growing and a number of fanzines were coming out with INSANITY always getting one of the best reviews and many orders were coming in for the ..85 rehearsal demo as the first recording came to be known, do you still remember in which fanzines were you featured? Did you often give interviews for fanzines?
The first was Violent Noize by Borivoj Krgyn there were a bunch of others like Decibel of Death, Metal Core, Ripping Headaches, Douche Rag, Speed Corps from Canada and Satanic Death from Japan to name a few. We did a ton of interviews back then for almost every fanzine we were in.
Would you say that the demo draw the fans attention to the band and more and more fans started interesting in the band? Did it open some doors for the band?
Some people have probably heard of the band because of the demo and a lot of people think it's a significant recording in the history and evolution of death metal. Especially people like Jeff from Carcass who told us Insanity was one of their main influences.
How many copies were sold from the demo at that time? Was this tape shopped around to attract label interests?
Unfortunately I didn't really count. It seemed like I used to send out about 20-30 a week at times but probably more than half of those were free copies going to fanzines or college radio stations. We were just about getting to the stage where we thought we'd be able to do a studio demo before a bunch of bad stuff started happening to the band.
Unfortunately this did not last long, after having problems with equipment and finding a rehearsal studio, Bud had to serve about 10 month's of jail time, what did he commit? Didn't you think about to sack Bud from the band and to search a new drummer instead of him?
He burglarized a liquor store. We would have liked to keep playing but there was no one around that could play like Bud because his drumming was one of the vital elements that made Insanity what it was in the early days.
Did Bud's jail time break the band's impetus on the wheel?
Yeah it was the first thing that started to screw us up in a major way.
During this time the only productive thing the band could do was to write new material, which songs did you write during this time? How did you approach the songwriting of the new material?
Ritual, Possession, Night of The Dead, there were a few more that weren't completed or ended up being parts of other songs. We didn't have a standard approach to writing, sometimes songs start with a riff or a lyric or even just an idea for a title.
So while you were preparing to record in a studio upon Bud's release so you could finally get signed, Joe became ill with a heart disease, what happened with him?
He got a rare virus that attacks the heart. When he first got sick his heart enlarged by one and a half times and it was weakened to the point where the doctors first said he would need a heart transplant within three weeks or he would die.
Which labels did start interesting in the band? Would you say, that was a great buzz around the band at this point?
Nuclear Blast was the first label I remember that contacted us. I think they were a few others but I don't remember the names. I would have loved to have signed with Nuclear Blast back then but the band was unable to do anything at that time in the wake of Joe's death.
You recorded one last rehearsal tape with Joe after a temporary release from the hospital but it was evident that some of his vocal power was gone due to the illness, what about this tape? I think so, Joe didn't feel in the right mood himself, right?
He was doing the best he could in his condition. I'm sure he was in the right mood he just lost some of his power after getting sick.
Several months later after a long up and down battle Joe DeZuniga died on May 16th 1987, which was a great shock for you, didn't you think about to give up everything and break up? You have lost a talented musician and a good friend, haven't you?
Yeah my life changed a lot after that. I was very angry, frustrated and depressed all at the same time. I drank and did drugs all the time to try and cope with what happened. At first I didn't play guitar at all for a while and but it was such a part of me eventually I started writing again and finished some of the songs Joe and I were working on.
A half year before Joe passed away unfortunately died Cliff Burton as well, who was also very young, like Joe…
Yeah that really sucked too. We were at the first 2 Metallica shows with Cliff Burton back to back Saturday nights at the Stone in S.F. Sometimes I think I can see myself at the front of the stage on the Cliff 'em All footage from that show.
After a long break the rest of you tried to keep the band going, but you couldn't find a singer with Joe's vocal strength and more problems we're yet to come including a number of line up changes for a number of different reason's that kept the band from doing anything significant for a while. Would you say, that it was hard to find the suitable replacement for Joe? Weren't any talented musicians around your surrounding?
Yeah there will never be a replacement for Joe and we could never match the chemistry of the original line up.
What kind of reasons did still hinder you work? What about the line up changes?
After Joe died line up changes and not being able to find the right people have hindered the band ever since.
At that time was POVERTY established which consisted of Bud Mills on the drums, Sean Riggen on vocals, Lou Gilberto on the bass and Scott Dodge on guitar, did the guys take the band seriously or was it meant a kind of project?
You would have to ask them. I'm sure they took it seriously in their own way.
Was POVERTY a reason, what hindered your work?
No. Although in hindsight it would have been better for Insanity trying to continue with Bud even though he lived far away and didn't even have a drum set when we first started playing with other drummers.
Did you like their demo „Poverty portrays truth"?
Of course, it has the legendary Bud Mills on it. I even recorded a demo for them called „Poverty Sucks" when their style was more metalcore.
Would you say, that you could continue the band, because the fans were devoted and you were driven by a never say die attitude?
I guess those would be the two main reasons. I just love playing the songs, we had a lot of fun just hanging out parting and laughing besides the time spent playing music.
You reformed in 1989, what was the line up at this point? Did your music change or did it remain the old school thrash/death metal?
When Keith and I first reformed the band in 89 we had Prakash Shama on drums, Matt Janko on guitar and Bob Martinez on vocals. The music didn't change but Bob had a drug problem that made his voice sound more like thrash than death metal sometimes and that is one of the reasons the band encouraged me to take over the lead vocals after I had been singing backup vocals for a while.
Would you say, that the Bay Area scene reached its peak at this point, but the newer acts, such as KAOS, EPIDEMIC, MILITIA weren't on that highly talented level, such as you, POSSESSED, EXODUS, DEATH ANGEL, HEATHEN etc. were?
I never though of it like that but I guess you could you could say so.
At the late '80's/early '90's thrash metal went out of fashion and it was a great death metal boom, so the timing of your reformation was perfect, do you agree with it?
Maybe worldwide but the local scene in the Bay Area started to suck for bands that weren't national acts in the Bay Area. Some of it was due to the "pay to play" policy clubs used to rip off bands and not having clubs like Ruthies Inn around anymore.
Don't you think, that around 1989/1900 death metal was becoming bigger and bigger to the detriment of speed/thrash and you still hadn't entered the likes of EXODUS, TESTAMENT, METALLICA etc. and it was already too late for INSANITY and you had lost all of your chances at this point to become bigger?
I guess so, like I said the local scene sucked at this point as well so it was par for the course and made me grow disillusioned with the whole thing eventually.
Have you ever cared of the trends? In your opinion, why did thrash loose its popularity at that time?
No. I don't care what other bands are doing. I just know what I like and try to remain true to myself which I think fans can appreciate because they can sense we are really into and not just going through the motions.
After a few years of struggling with a couple of line-up changes, Insanity signed a one-record deal with a German independent record label Black Lung and released the debut „Death after death", but unfortunately the band was not complete when labels such as Nuclear Blast offered to sign the band, what was the problem, why weren't you complete?
Because that was right after Joe died and we wouldn't have been able to come close to recreating the sound Insanity had been known for at that time.
What about Black Lung/M. B. R.? Were they a small label?
They were a small label but as Matt Harvey mentioned to me, there wasn't that much difference between them and Nuclear Blast back then and I couldn't tell the future and know which label would fold and which one would become huge...
Why couldn't you accept the deal of Nuclear Blast? Did they offer you a good contract? Would you say, that a deal with Nuclear Blast would have been better for the band?
Nuclear Blast would have definitely been better but as they say hindsight is 20/20. After Joe died it just seemed impossible that we could record an album so that's why I didn't right back at the time. Of course I wish I would have contacted them after the band started playing again but I can't change the past, I can only go forward.
The album contains only your demos, why didn't you put newer tracks on it? Were the tracks simply re-recorded, mixed and remastered?
It was going to be our first official release since the 85 demo so we thought we should make a real album of those tracks before releasing newer material. All the songs were recorded from scratch, that is the purpose of going into a recording studio.
Do you consider „Death after death" as an an onslaught of old-school death metal with extreme thrash influences, by an ambient noise and a slowly picked acoustic guitar?
That sounds like a good description although the slowly picked acoustic guitar is only for the intro of "Attack of Archangels"…
Can you give us details on the record?
Well, we recorded the basics (rhythm tracks) in two days at a studio called Audio Voyage in Livermore, CA. After the label heard the first mixes, they gave us a little more money to go in and redo some vocals and mix it in a bigger studio so we went to Hyde Street in San Francisco which is where Joe Satriani worked on a bunch of albums.
Were you satisfied with the sound? Did the tracks sound like in the old days, I mean, didn't they loose from their pure aggression?
Not completely, I had a difficult time getting the engineer to understand terms like "Brutal" as far as what we wanted and being in the experience of having to produce the album and only having experience recording the live rehearsal demos made me want to learn about audio engineering.
If the record could have came out earlier –for example during '86/87-, would have been INSANITY a more known band who have a huge reputation, respect in the underground? Would have been the record a classic, influential death metal one?
I'd like to think so. A lot of the early reviews we got from the 85 demo said we had the potential to RULE!
Would have significantly changed the band's career if things happened differently?
Of course it would have because then (as Matt Harvey wrote on the From The Grave liner notes) Insanity would be mentioned along with the likes of Possessed, Death and Morbid Angel not too mention we'd have a more albums out and we would have done a lot of touring as well.
INSANITY played live numerous times in 1993-94 with the most notable show being at the Omni with the reformed POSSESSED (Mike Torrao has been a good friend of Insanity since 1985) & MACHINE HEAD on March 12, 1993, any memories of this show?
Hell yes! That was a great show. It was also my first show singing. There was a video made of it with two camera's and it is on the DVD were working on
As far as POSSESSED, how did they sound like? What was the line up of the band? In my opinion, without Jeff Becerra, it wasn't worth to reform the band.
Well being a friend of Mike Torrao, I have a different opinion and appreciated being able to hear the songs again. They had a very good drummer and Mike had a cool voice but obviously Jeff's is one of the most classic death metal voices of all time. Jeff has become a friend of mine as well and I might try to get him to do some guest vox for Insanity in the future.
After drummer Prakash Sharma's back problems became serious the band took a break in late '94, wasn't he able to bear the physical burdens or did he have other problems?
He still has problems to this day. He is in extreme pain most of the time and walks with a cane. It is a huge shame because he is one of the most talented drummers I've ever played with and is one of the best friends I've ever had.
The whole metal thing was onto an extinction phase during the early/mid '90s, with many bands either breaking up or changing their sound for something that had nothing to do with their original approach (METALLICA), how do you see it?
Yeah it seemed like Testament for one tried using the "Metallica" formula that brought them major success. There was some fads happening like "funk metal" that bands like Kaos followed plus the whole grunge thing happened and real metal suffered because of it.
Do you also think, that metal in general seemed to be a kind of died on a large scale being killed by grunge and pop/punk?
Yeah I would agree with that.
In 1997, the band reformed and you began working on new material, but what did you during those three years?
I had a job and a girlfriend and almost got married. I guess I drifted away from playing music for a while because I got tired of all the bullshit and bad breaks.
A 3 song CD called „Sacrefixion" has been released, was it similar to the old way of the band or would you say, that you turned into a modern direction?
I'd say it's a bit of both. It still has the Insanity sound but we have become better musicians and started writing longer songs with guitars harmonizing or playing different parts more often. We also starting incorporating a second deeper voice occasionally to add more variety to the vocals.
What about those songs respectively about the circumstances of the recordings?
Sacrefixion is one of my favorite Insanity songs and starts of with blazing speed for a long time before changing into stomping double kick parts. Dread The Dawn is a song that expanded the realm of what we thought we could do and is one of the songs I'm most proud of writing. Mortification is a very heavy moshing song with great vocal patterns and the verses have some cool dual guitar parts that overlap and transition into eachother. These songs were recorded at the studio I used to engineer at and I learned a lot during the process.
There were unfortunately big differences in levels of dedication, money spent and effort put in strained relations between band members and this line up broke up in late 2001, what happened? What kind of reasons did lead to the breaking up?
Well the question pretty much stated the problem. Everyone was in it for different reasons at the time, and drinking seemed to be the only thing everyone was serious about. I was making a lot of sacrifices including not taking good paying jobs so we could record the album so there was a lot of tension and we had a blow up but everything got patched up and we played Murderfest last year together.
After INSANITY was reformed in 2005 the band played the first show in many years in San Francisco June 8th, how were you participated by the fans? Did you enjoy the show?
It wasn't the best show because we were just getting started again and wanted to keep it low key. We had bigger and better things planned we wanted to get ready for.
What do you think about reformations which happened in the last 5-6 years, such as HEATHEN, DEATH ANGEL, NUCLEAR ASSAULT, CELTIC FROST, METAL CHURCH, AGENT STEEL, HIRAX etc.? Would you say, that these bands have never been as big as they are nowadays?
Yep the Old School is BACK!
Do you like their present albums? Can be compared the present records of these bands to their classic, immortal ones or are there two different worlds, which isn't worth to compare to each other?
I haven't heard all of these bands latest material although I will be getting the latest Death Angel that just came out as soon as I can. Even then some things are classic because they become a familiar part of our past so for a lot of people nothing will ever live up to the earlier stuff.
While you were booked for other shows to prepare for a West Coast tour with EXHUMED from August 25th-28th, drummer Colin Osness broke his hand, a bad luck again... It meant, that you had cancel the shows, right?
No, we were about to and even contacted Bud about filling in but he got better just in time although we weren't sure if he'd be able to make it though a whole show much less multiple shows night after night.
Luckily after Colin's cast was removed and was cleared to play on the 19th, the band was able to rehearse a few times before the first show at The Pound in San Francisco and continuing on to Southern California, how did the whole tour go?
It was awesome! We gained a lot of new fans and made some good connections as well. All the band members from the different bands were really cool to hang out with and we had a blast. Although we did have some drama with a friend we were supposed to stay at in Hollywood and someone tried to steal the bass guitar the next night and I didn't get any sleep and was running on fumes by the last show at the Jumping Turtle although the guys in Cattle Decapitation that were there seemed to be impressed and we were supposed to play with them down there before Bud got sick.
INSANITY gained many new fans on the road helping to re-spark interest in the band to a new generation of metal fans, would you say that INSANITY's name is still big and it is still in people's mind?
I would say that Insanity's name is big in the minds of those who know the bands material or have seen us live but we are still no where near as big as we would have been if a few things happened differently.
In 2004 Matt Harvey from EXHUMED contacted you with the idea of releasing a compilation of early Insanity material on his new label Parasitic Twin Productions, which is a 70 minute compilation called „From The Grave", was it an honour for you? Weren't interested any labels releasing this material?
It was an honor, and it really helped get our material circulated and with worldwide distribution. Since it was Matt's idea and he would have Relapse Records distribute it (at least in the U.S.), I didn't see any reason to be trying to shop it around to other labels.
From the grave is a 70 minute compilation of vintage INSANITY material from 1985-1994, this CD chronicles the band from the '85 Live/Rehearsal Demo, the „Death After Death" release and remixed & completed versions of 1993-94 8 track demo songs including Carnivore, Ritual, Night Of The Dead, Extinction and a recording of an old classic Ultimate Death with rhythm tracks recorded in 1998, whose idea was to release this album? Can you tell us more about it?
It was Matt Harvey's idea. A few years earlier he had the idea of covering an Insanity song but he said since Napalm Death beat him to it, he wanted to release a compilation of Insanity material as he was starting a label called Parasitic Twin. Unfortunately, although he did get us distribution with Relapse he never follows through with anything from promoting it to finishing getting the contracts signed or paying us the royalties due and has avoided just about every attempt we've made to contact him and finalize things which has been a major source of frustration since he also helped us out so much and we don't want to burn that bridge either.
As far as the record, what we get here is a good old package of insane old school death metal that just leaves the listener obliterated by its intense speed and aggression, how do you see this?
I would agree with that, I like that description although I am a perfectionist and still think it could have been better.
Do you think, that INSANITY are one of those bands who were part of the growing extreme metal scene from the mid 80's to early 90's and who didn't receive as much credit as they should of along with several other great bands who only made it through demos during the 80's such as NECROVORE, PENTAGRAM(Chile), SINDROME, TERMINAL DEATH, INCUBUS ( Florida) etc.?
In some ways. Because of the bad luck of the band, we didn't get the exposure I think we deserved but that's because things got derailed so quickly. The fanzines we were in actually gave us a lot of credit and we would usually receive the most positive reviews.
In this compilation of INSANITY's music the listener can notice that you kept that same fast, aggressive, non-boring sound throughout all the releases in here and your sound can be described as if one had POSSESSED and DEVASTATION (Chicago) put together, but with more technicality, do you agree with it?
Yes, again I think you've described it well! –fast, aggressive, non-boring old school death metal with more technicality!
The vocals are great and it can't be really compared them to anyone else's; the guitars are insanely technical and very powerful, the riffs are catchy, the drumming is very fast, typical thrash beat but 10 times faster, how do you see it?
Wow, I didn't think my vocals were all that, I just try to make it sound raspy and as powerful and I can (although I feel I've been smoking too much pot until recently) but thank you. I've always tried to write technical and powerful riffs but keeping them catchy has been key! Playing faster than thrash has been a trademark of Insanity as well as Bud was an old school pioneer creating faster tempos in extreme drumming.
This will help to give the band a new level of exposure and will help spread INSANITY like a worldwide plague, is that correct?
Definitely! We've been hearing from a lot of new fans from all over the world as well as old school fans that still have the original 85 demo. It has really helped to fuel the resurgence
I read about another compilation called „Ultimate death", what about this release? Is it a bootleg stuff or an official one?
It's not really an "official" release. That was made for some fans that wanted to get the full 85 demo on CD. I did some mastering and added some songs that also appeared on From The Grave from a 94 demo.
How happened, that „Demo '85" Came free with issue 15 of Snakepit Magazine?
Laurent Ramadier who has been one of our biggest fans and strongest supporters from the early days asked if he could include a 6" vinyl of the demo with his Magazine. He also gave us a bunch to sell at shows and from our website.
How do you feel, when you see that there's still people who really understood how great INSANITY was and who still enjoy your music after all those years?
That is one of the main reasons why we still try to keep the band going despite how much bad luck and setbacks we have sufferred through. The fans mean everything and it does make me feel validated for not quiting when I hear from them.
Last year unfortunately died Bud Mills…
Yeah it's been a real fucked up time. He was a one of a kind friend and drummer. After we played Murderfest it felt like the band was finally back on track in a major way. Besides planning on more west coast shows, we started preparing to re-record the Visions of Apocalypse release because we made a bunch of small improvements and a couple songs changed a lot. Unfortunately we will have to release the recordings Bud tracked in 2001 instead. I'm just starting to get back on track after being depressed for quite a while and I plan on completing the final mixes in the next few months.
My last question: how would you charakterize the career of INSANITY from the formation 'til the last show respectively your bandmates, including Joe DeZuniga and Bud?
We started off with all the potential in the world and with Joe's death everything fell apart before we could make a major impact. We used to joke about being "cursed" because of the timing of certain events like amps not working the day of a show and a bunch of crap like that. We definitely had some of the worst luck of any band I know of. It seemed like we had the world in the palm of our hands and it slipped through our fingers but the most tragic thing of all is to lose good friends. Joe and Bud were the some of the best friends I've ever had, and you can't replace friendships like that. On the other hand, some great things have happened in the last three years with the From The Grave release, being covered by Napalm Death, the Exhumed tour and the Murderfest show we've played. Before Bud's death, it seemed like Insanity was making up for a lot of lost time.
Dave, thanks a lot for your patience and answers, I hope you enjoyed the feature, anything to add what I forgot to cover?
Your welcome, thanks for the support. Look for the Visions of Apocalypse release soon and well as our upcoming DVD featuring Buds last show at Murderfest in Hollywood, CA. Music videos and other footage of Insanity shows over the years. T-Shirts of the original logo are also available from the bands website at http://www.blacklungproductions.com/insanity
Buy some Insanity Merchandise! We need the support!

Virus - Ian Coke McFinlay

The interview was done some years ago. This is/was my tribute to the legendary British thrash band, that reunited for two years ago.

So Coke, how, under which circumstances did you discover metal and what did you find so amazing in this music?
Well now thats an interesting question my friend, ive always loved metal from its very beginnings with bands like Black Sabbath, Motörhead,Iron Maiden..etc but my main turning point came when i heard Rush...this type of Music just bowled me over completely..it was refreshing,technical & completely different to anything else i had ever heard before.
Do you consider yourself a metal head or did you prefer punk?
I was into metal before punk i used to listen to early Judas Priest albums & wishing i could play guitar like Glen Tipton & K K Downing...but i consider myself to be a Thrasher!!!
The great English metal boom started around '79/'80, the new Wave Of British Heavy Metal came into being, would you say that time of the punk scene was up or did they exist next to each other?
Many NWOBHM bands were influenced by the punk bands & they lived a happy existence along side them, you see back then you would see punks running around with Iron Maiden & Judas priest patches on their jackets & Metalheads with Sex Pistols on their Jackets
How do you remember those times? Did you like bands, such as SAXON, MOTÖRHEAD, JUDAS PRIEST, IRON MAIDEN, GIRLSCHOOL, GRIM REAPER, BLITZKRIEG etc.?
Yeh all those bands i really liked,but Priest really stood out above the rest for me,becos of their musicianship...they had a harder edge to their music & this got me into bands like Diamond Head & Saxon.
At which point did you pick up guitar and how did your choice fall on this instrument?
I started playing guitar when i was 18...yeah i know i was a late starter,but i was playing bagpipes since i was 12 &was prepared to give that up just yet,but when my father died i couldn't play anymore so for a couple of years i was in the wilderness so to speak..then i heard a friend of my brothers play some Ozzy& Van Halen covers & i was sold...& ive never looked back
What were your influences to become musician? Were you self taught or…?
Yeah im very self taught as i used to listen to Van Halen & play theyre tracks by ear which were totally shit renditions..& i apologize to Eddie in advance ..lol,then i heard Randy Rhodes & thot man!!if only i could play like that guy i could really show people i could rocket up that fretboard..so i practiced 12 hours a day,i was 18 & a punk & everyone thot i was shit but it didnt put me off...i lost a lot of drinkin time coz i used to hibernate. I bought the tabulature book for the album 'Powerslave' by Maiden before i bought the album so i could work out the piece before i heard it
What about your musical past before you were involved in VIRUS?
I played 2 bands before Virus....one was a very mediocre punk band called Urban Decay & the other was a French punk band called Crash C13 who needed a guitarist before that i was a piper in the Mckenzie Calidonian PipeBand in Dundee in Scotland for 6 glorious years.
The band was formed in 1986 by vocalist Henry Heston and drummer Terry Kaylor –both of them played in punk/oi band CRIMINAL DAMAGE- and the brought Damien Hess on bass, do you still remember how did you get in the picture exactly? Were you the first choice of the band or were there other musicians still in the mind? Did you know them earlier?
The answer to that question is very simple i knew these guys before for a longtime,we met as punks in a venue called The100 Club in central London where i was workin for a while as a glass collector.I was down on my luck in 1986 & sleeping rough & they found me sleeping under a flyover next to the Hammersmith Odeon.in London,they bought me lunch & asked what i was doin for money & i said i was buskin Clash songs in soho.Now they had heard me play a few years before this in a Squat in South london & i entertained them back then but they never asked me to join Criminal Damage.They offered me a lifeline to join Virus,apprantley someone told them i was a shit hot guitarist
What about the musical background of Damien Hess?
Damien again was a big punk fan but was heavily influenced by trippy bands like Pink Floyd & Hawkwind,which is where i think he got his individual style which added that dimension to Virus that was taking them to new heights
Would you say that VIRUS were one of the pioneers of British thrash metal? Did the British thrash scene started with bands, such as VIRUS, SABBAT, ONSLAUGHT?
Yeh i would say so....weve influenced a shitload of bands thru the years not just in the UK but all over.Yes bands like DeathWish, Acid Reign, Deliverance, Cathedral & the ones you mentioned above & to name but a few all contributed to the start of British Thrash.
Who came up with the name of the band?
Henry did altho they werent all in agreement at first, i think they rowed quite a bit about it .
What about your rehearsals? Did you start writing originals right from the start or were you jamming mostly on punk/oi materials?
We rehearsed only our own material right from the get go,we werent interested in tryin to copy anyone,we wanted to bring the two musical styles of Oi/punk & metal together to create a whole new genre that would let punks listen to thrash & metalheads listen to more punk stuff & i think we accomplished this with PREY FOR WAR altho it wasn't greatly appreciated in metal circles unlike POWER FROM HELL by Onslaught but we were more original than them & took more risks musically.
How many demos did you record? Were these materials your first studio experiences?
The demos would feature session guitar solos of Yaasin Hanif of TARGA, why did you take his services on the demos?
Yaasin was a very good friend of Henry's,they got him to do the solo's on PREY FOR WAR as Henry cudnt solo...i wasn't in the band at this time but i don't think they wanted him in band becos he didnt fit in visually.What i mean by that is he wudnt dress in the style of a hardcore thrasher,they needed someone who looked the part aswell as being a decent musician,he was too glam to be in a thrash band even although he was an exeptional guitarist.
Did you shop around the demos to attract label interests?
Not really we were picked up pretty quickly by METALWORKS,they were one of the first we saw & they immediately thought we could make them money,but we were naive coz they fucked us over good & proper in the end & they baffeled us with theyre bullshit..they were 2 PR men from Bronze Records so they new the buisness very well.
Finally you got signed by Metal Works, did you choose them because they offered you a good contract or because there weren't other label interests?
They chose us!! they already had Bernie Torme on their books & a few other up & coming bands but we were theyre first thrash band
As far as the label, what about their releases? I know, they released the power metal classic „Ample destruction" of JAG PANZER.
Well like i said they had Bernie Torme who was huge in the 80's but we thot he was cock rock frankly & a bit of a tosser also they had Deliverance,Deathwish,Skinny Puppy,Mystic & a few others i can't remember about but not worth talkin abt anyway..we ended up being their main interst & they dropped several bands to concentrate on us
What about the recording sessions of the first record „Pray for war", which saw the light in 1987?
That was really recorded in 86 to be honest & wasnt released till 87 but i can tell you this, it was recorded in Brighton & it took 3 hours to record & it was gonna be scrapped & redone untill one of our m8s heard it & let certain people in Brighton hear it.We were advised to keep it so we did!!
The record was completely funded by yourself, which didn't make many waves in the press, does it mean that you didn't have a decent budget to record the album?
Thats correct!! the guys were practically peniless &it wasn't the grarest of recording facilities...in actual fact it was done in Yassin's garage that he had converted into a recording studio,but at the time it was the only thing that was available & cheap!
How much time did the recordings sessions take?
Like i said 3 hours!!!!!!
Yaasin Hanif would also be on hand to produce the first album, didn't you think about to admit him as a permanent member in the band?
Yeah its true Yaasin did play a big part in the recording but like i said he just didnt fit the style of the band & he wasnt interested in playing that kind of music full-time.
Were you satisfied with the end result?
When they let me hear the demo i wasnt that impressed in fact i thought it was pretty dull lacklustre & lacked imagination but i thought to myself,i could do something with this sound...so when we eventually played live these tracks were more heavier &technical than they were on vinyl.
This album represents the underground scene in its most undeveloped form, do you agree with it?
Yeh totally!! it was grass roots thrash, i think THERMO-NUCLEAR THRASH was the only decent track on the album,but youve got to remember that we had a big ex-punk following,who were listening to the likes of DISCHARGE, BROKEN BONES & GBH.so technically we were the most advanced post punk band out of them all& this was evident in our music, as at the time we were being compared to these bands.
In 1987 was released The Force by Onslaught, what I name the best British thrash metal record…
Yeh your probably right it was the best that Britain had to offer at the time, but if you had seen us live in the 80's we were visually far superior to Onslaught, we had an energy & a presence onstage that no thrash band in Britain could equal, Onslaught were boring to watch but i agree their studio opus THE FORCE was excellent.
VIRUS hit the stage for the very first time supporting SUICIDAL TENDENCIES and punk outfit CHELSEA at the Clarendon in London, how do you remember that show?
The Suicidal show was just an amazing memory for me, i got to meet my favourite band of all time & we really kicked ass that night..our very first show so we had to create a good impression...we practiced every day as we had our own rehearsal room & for this gig it was important that we got it spot on...I remember there was famous skaters from the USA who turned up that nite...Mike McGill, Lance Mountain, Steve Caballero & Nicky Guerro all told me they loved the show!
Would you say, that VIRUS were clearly below the average of the British thrash metal genre in the beginning?
I have to agree with you in one respect as PREY FOR WAR could have been the 'kiss of death' for us,but in another,i have to say we didnt pack out venues in the South of England if we were below average at the start!!Granted it was a large Punk audience but we wanted to gain a more metal one!!!
After the releasing of the record you toured as support to the KREATOR and CELTIC FROST UK tour of October 1987 respectively you put in shows opening for DEATH ANGEL and SUICIDAL TENDENCIES, what do you recall of all of these tours?
Absolutely fantastic time of my life, met some lifelong friends played hard, partyed hard & was totally in the zone throughout that touring time..altho there were some serious issues with band members at this point,they were overshadowed by the good times.
Around this time started popping up more and more British thrash bands, such as D. A. M., DEATHWISH, ACID REIGN, XENTRIX, ANNIHILATED to what could thank thrash metal its popularity?
I think we all owe a debt of thanks to VENOM coz they were the forefathers of thrash metal in Britain & broke the mould for other bands like us to push the scene forward to another level
Do the British bands play an important role in the forming of the European thrash scene?
I don't think so & i will tell you why! The metallers in Europe were swallowed up by the big hitters of the genre from the U.S.A i.e. metallica, Slayer & Megadeth & the British bands didnt really get the exposure they deserved in Europe,due to lack of interest from the European media.Now this was at the beginning of the scene in Europe & of course they had an abundance of homegrown talent of their own that they were promoting to a U.S audience.
Did the English thrash bands get all of the respect, what the German thrash bands got back then?
It was hard back then, as Helloween, Tankard, Sodom, Kreator & the likes were gathering a huge following in Britain &trying to compete with these bands was near impossible for us,but musically we gained their respect as they could see that British Thrash wasnt goin to be pushed aside by the public in favour of the more accomplished German thrash outfits.
Parallel with the thrash scene appeared some death metal/grindcore outfits as well, such as CARCASS, BOLT THROWER, CANCER, PARADISE LOST, BENEDICTION etc., were you close to this brutal, uncompromising music?
I remember in early 88, we did a headline gig in the Walthamstowe greyhound it was near Shepherds Bush in London, Annihilated were on the bill so we knew them & it was their 2nd gig with us. One of the bands that night turned up with no equipment& our manager refused to let them use our gear,so we told our manager to fuck off & let them use it!he was furious but we said 'hey you old fucker their only kids give them a chance you dick!!'the average age was about 16 & it was their first gig, they couldnt even get served at the bar!I wish we hadn't now coz they blew us off the stage(completely),they were technically perfect & very aggressive riffs which i loved..that band was CARCASS & i really liked this new powerful grindcore/Death Metal sound so i started listening to bands like Death & Obituary!!
In 1988 Metal Works released the „Metalworks personal sampler" featuring LORD CRUCIFIER, DELIVERANCE, VIRUS and ANNIHILATED, what kind of purposes did this material serve, what was released only on cassette?
It was all released on cassette & vinyl & it was to promote each of our albums releases that year.
You were featured with the tracks „Testify to me" and „Force Recon", were they the very first written songs to the second album?
Yeh Testify To Me was the first track written for the 2nd album we wanted to keep the speed metal thing goin coz it seemed to be what everyone wanted & we didnt want to disappoint our fans,but i wanted to put loads of short changes & little bridge parts in the song to show some diversity & to fuck the media off by showing them we could play as we got really bad reviews for the first album in Kerrang!
Did you immediately start writing new material after the releasing of the first album? How did the recordings sessions go with this material?
No not exactly,we wanted to see what impact it would have in the press,but it bombed badly as i thought it would,so i got all my influences together &shut myself away in the band room(as the others gave me carte blanche to do what the fuck i wanted musically)!personally i think they ran out of ideas & needed something much better!
As far as myself, you turned into a more complex direction, the structures of the songs became more varied, such as „Testify to me", the instrumental „Viral warfare", the title track or „Hungry for blood", what do you think about it?
Yeh your dead right!! up till then they didnt have a songwriter in the band & i remember havin a conversation with Henry i said....'hey man we seriously need to reshape the sound & the structure of our songs, PREY FOR WAR is fuckin neanderthal man,we need to reconstruct a new sound or were gonna get swallowed up by new bands comin into this genre. So i did i was listenin to EXODUS & SUICIDAL TENDENCIES a lot at this time so i drew from them little passages i thot that might elevate us a band,i didnt copy!! no no no i would never do that(like a lot of Brit bands were doin!!mentioning no names!!)lol. I merely took their stylings & mixed them up a bit.this was probably the benchmark set for the next album LUNACY.
What made you to put an instrumental title on the record?
Oh thats easy to answer!!I didnt want Henry's vocals spoilin a really gr8 track...hahahahahaaha!!
Would you say, that people really started to take notice of the true potential of the band, which was enforced by the thrash stylings of you, which took the band to new heights in the genre?
Yeh would say that, without tryin to sound like a bighead, coz to be honest i didnt see a future for the band if they were to continue down the punk/metal crossover thing!Youve got to remember these guys were listening to thrash or punk bands only whereas i would listen thrash & punk as well as to stuff that was totally free of metal i.e JAZZ, SKA, REGGAE, BLUES, FUNK & CLASSICAL.
Why did you change your logo as well?
Again we needed a fresh more professional sound so we needed to have a fresh new professional lookin logo,the old one was too punky to ragged & didnt suit our sound so it got binned!! We were all in agreement of that
You gained a slot at the prestigious Leeds thrash festival alongside MEGADETH, what about this show?
When we got news we were to be on the bill we were totally dumbfucked we couldnt believe we were goin to be rubbin shoulders with the mighty MEGADETH & all those others on the bill. We had just come to the end date of the Cro-mags tour & we it was Xmas 89 i think & things were goin really well for us the tour was a gr8 success & our manager was finalizing things on the tour bus. Onslaught were due to play it too but as soon as they found out we were on the bill they pulled out coz we were bitter rivals & we'd had a punch up with them that year. They said somethin bad about us in press & we took great offense to it so we went lookin for them (wankers). The gig was a huge affair with about 7000 people turnin up we were first on & becos we were extremely hungover,we were in a right state we could have died on our feet up there coz everything that could have gone wrong,did go wrong, Damien stood on Henry's lead & broke it i stood on Damiens lead & it broke too, it was just me & Tez playin. Our roadies just froze, didnt do a fuckin thing to help (useless cunts) & we went from bad to worse we started to throw cans of beer & T-shirts to gain audience approval but they got thrown back,henry asked me to do a solo while the roadies at last fixed the problem (that went down like a pair of lead socks attached to an anvil & thrown in a river & expected to float) lol. By the time everything got sorted out we could only do one more number! so we did 'THE MUNSTER MOSH the hidden track on FORCE RECON. The crowed went absolutely mental for 7 rows back they were bouncin up & down & moshin like fuck, i couldnt believe my eyes but it fuckin saved us that nite!!
The press always dogged you because of your strong punk roots and you often had to defense yourselves in the media for your pro-punk leanings, why did it happen? It didn't help you when you punched out Xavier Russell of Kerrangg in the Kit Kat club in London in 1988,who was reviewing your album that year. I suppose, you didn't like his review, do you?
Yeah we never escaped that proclamation from the British press & Xavier Russel was the biggest dickhead in metal at that time,unfortunately he was the most important metal journalist in the media too.I met this Italian chick in The Interpid Fox(famous metal pub in London)she was fuckin georgeous & she was all over me like a rash,she asked us to join her at the famous Kit Kat Club in Soho so we did unfortunately for me she forgot to tell me she was Xaviers girlfriend so when he showed up there he was arguin with her & he starts slapping her so i headbutted him & punched him over a table,i was busy layin into him when someone told me who he was!! I didnt give a fuck!!Rule number 1 i said you don't hit women!!! We got one K for our album which was grossley unfair coz Metal Hammer gave us 5 stars.
Is it true that you were labeled the bad boys of Thrash metal, simply because most of your gigs ended up in fights, drunken brawls and roadie punch ups, but you still maintained a modicum of decorum when you met your fans?
Youve been reading our Myspace profile my friend!! yes it was true we were more infamous than famous...i couldnt write down all the mad punch ups we had with other bands & some Virus Haters, but yeh we were branded as thugs,but we did look after our fans so they appreciated us!! nuff said!!
„Lunacy" was released in 1989, how was the album recorded? Did the label ask you to hear new material or did they still have a complete confidence into it?
The album was recorded in Putney Bridge in London in a place called THE YARD studio, where THE CULT had recorded their album ELECTRIC CIRCUS it was a gr8 place we ate drank slept shat & pissed in that place it was luxurious & our sound engineer had worked with many well known stars such as DEF LEPPARD, SCORPIONS, JESUS & MARY CHAIN, COCTEAU TWINS & CAPTAIN SENSIBLE. Man we were so excited with workin with him,but he just couldnt handle us,i think he had a nervous breakdown after we left. lol. The record company had full confidence in us on the new material they came down to the bandroom to hear the new stuff & loved it.. i could see pound signs formin in their greedy little fuckin eyes!!lol
Compared to the earlier efforts by you, „Lunacy" showed some definite improvement in both production and songwriting, the sound of the album is very heavy and the general feel much more varied than previously, how do you view it?
Yeh i felt it could have been even better if they had only given me a little more time to tweak it. There was one or 2 things i wanted to change but we were on a timeline to get it out & into the shops so i had to settle with what we had..but all in all we did a pretty good job. You won't notice the mistakes but i do & i cringe everytime i hear a certain song where Henry's guitar goes out of time & there is one where i make a blatant drop in mistake...lol
There are a lot of intriguing, genuine touches on the songs, which makes this album on the whole fairly interesting, compared to the first two ones…
I have to laugh...hehehehe when you say 'fairly interesting'it sounds like its not bad but nothing special, but i think if you had heard it at that time it would have been more than fairly interesting..lol
Would you say, that with „Lunacy" you stepped in a higher level, as far as songwriting, playing, sound etc.?
Definitely!!! we had a bigger budget,one of the best recording studio's in Britain & an excellent producer in 'Bernie'. We were evolving as a band & we were getting more into the region of what i wanted us to be as a band!! musically & live sound.
This time the plain vocals are more emphasized and sound quite peculiar yet very original, although they are a bit too weak and unclear and almost get buried under the bass-heavy production, were you dissatisfied with the sound?
I wasn't dissatisfied with the music or lyrics what really pissed me off was Henry's lack of enthusiasm to project his voice & his inability to do his vocals properly,he really thought he was a fuckin rock star,he'd turn up to practice once or twice a week & sometimes drunk & i wanted to just knock him out sometimes.While we were tryin to make this a really gr8 album he was out with his mates pissin it up.He really was one talentless prick!! We needed it to be base heavy to cover up his shit vocals!!
Is „Lunacy" a fairly nice recording from the heydays of British thrash metal?
It could have been so much more than fairly nice!!!!!!
What were the shows to support the record?
We toured with Death Angel in Britain & France, Acid Reign again in Britain a double headliner with Sabbat in London. Lawnmower Deth in North of England tour, Motorhead ADX (french metal band) & Loudblast (also from France) in the Zenith in Paris. Kreator in Germany & Poland & Christmas on earth in Leeds.
You were due to tour North America with DEATH, but this was cancelled, what happened exactly?
There was a bitter disagreement between me & Henry at home he threatened to walk out on the band & i said 'well fuck off then youve got the least talent anyway' he left for about a week, meanwhile we were busy writing new material for a fourth album 2 new songs for the tour, he turns up one night & say's he's splitting the band up, i thought he was jokin..the fucker had just walked out on us then he makes this ludicrious fuckin statement, i was livid & said we have a 4 month tour in America scheduled & you tell us that now..but i was to find out later that there was an alterior motive for this!!!
If you would have had the opportunity playing in the States, could you have made a name for the band?
Well put it this way!! Our album Lunacy sold 15000 copies in New York in its first 2 weeks of release over there so i think that speaks for itself.....i still get 100s of myspace messages from fans sayin why didnt we come over to the states & play??
Some problems, troubles and conflicts emerged within the band, what went wrong with you? Can you tell us more about it?
I think i explained that earlier, but i will say one thing Henry had a plan with the record company & the management to go behind our backs & he had already been to the states to promote himself more than anything unbeknown to the rest of us he was plotting our downfall,i think that in my opinion he couldn't keep up with the rest of us musically & was getting tired of me busting his balls every time he decided he was ready to come to band practice.I had threatened him with violence on several ocassions,i just never put up with his crap like the others did!!That was maybe a big mistake coz it was partly the reason for the demise of the band.
Does it mean, that the line up divided into two parts?
Yep!! Fraid so yeh see Henry & Tez were childhood mates,john wasn't in their inner circle & me being scottish & not English with my aggressive attitude& behaviour upset the apple cart so to speak!
What kind of reasons did lead to the splitting up exactly? How and when did end up the whole VIRUS story?
It was when Henry got back from the U.S.he told us he was takin his girlfriend up the coast for a 2 week holiday...but it was a lie he had been in New York with our record company. When he eventually came clean about his trip we had a massive bust up i walked out Damien just kept quiet as he usually did Tez flew off the handle,we wanted to lynch the fucker right there.we didnt speak to each other for about a week i had the management calling me but i ignored the phone, i was having my own breakdown,my wife had left me,taken our 6 week old baby & went back to France, i couldn’t stand to be in the same room as henry or blood would have flown mostly his. I went back to the band room the following Monday coz Damo wanted to see me..when i got there.It was boarded up & he told me that Henry & Tez had gone to the States & with the management & all our royalties & me & Damo were left with fuck all!!
Did you part ways with a friendly term at the end?
No comment( see above)
Would you say that you reached a cult status in the underground scene? A lot of underground maniacs like you these days as well…
Yeh but its funny were more popular these days than we ever were when we were giggin....lol.I think its due to the interest in 80's thrash by this new generation & bands like TESTAMENT, FORBIDDEN, DEATH ANGEL, MUNICIPAL WASTE & others keeping the genre alive!!
After the demise of the band Henry Heston and Terry Kaylor formed SAVAGE CIRCUS, until when did this outfit exist? Did they record any demos, albums etc.?
They started that band in the states after they left me & Damo for dead!!!I have no interest in what they did with this band,nor do i care, you'll have to ask them about that!!!
What about you and Damien Hess after VIRUS?
I believe Damo went to Hawai to start his gardening business, & became very successful at it, as for me i have played in to many thrash bands thru the years to mention them all,but i'll mention the best ones...i spent 5 years in France tryin to make amends with my estranged wife,while i was there i played for MISTER-E great musicians but they had no scope to tour!!After that came ODDMONGERS another french band very technical reminicent of TOXIC CIRCUS & WATCHTOWER i played lead for them! In the summer of 96 i returned to Scotland & formed PRODUCTS OF FEAR i loved the PANTERAesque sound we had & i had never felt more comfortable with a band we lasted 3 years but never played out of Scotland(shame coz we were very good...ive played in several covers bands thru the years but the one that sticks out the most was ZOMBIESTOMP typical classic rock! Iv now have my own band again called SPLATTERHEAD you can check out us out at www.myspace.com/splatterheadspace.com let me know what ye think man!!
Did you follow what's going on in the underground scene?
Yeh iv never stopped checkin man!!
At the late '80s/early '90s thrash metal started going out of fashion, a lot of British thrash bands splitted up, such as DEATHWISH, D. A. M., SABBATH or changed their style, such as ONSLAUGHT, RE-ANIMATOR, how do you remember those times?
Very sad times for British thrash, it all seemed to crash & burn & it was a roller coaster of disaster...all the British thrash bands who were left just ran out of ideas & started to play regurgitated bullshit that no-one wanted to hear.
In 1993 released Mia Records the „Warmonger the compilation" record, what was the goal of the label with this release? Were you aware of this record at all?
I wasn't aware of that record untill an American friend e-mailed me in 98 & said 'did you know there was a Virus compilation album', which me & Damien received fuck all from.
As far as VIRUS, you are running both a band and an own site on the myspace, when did you start running these sites?
I have been running my own site for the past 2 years & had no intention of starting a VIRUS mypace, but a friend of mine from London H who was the lead Vocalist of ACID REIGN told me that they had a website & got loads of feedback from it so i decided this year to launch it much to my surprise iv had a huge response from all over the globe.
Does internet play an important role in the life of the people these days? What are the advantages and disadvantages of the internet?
1 huge disadvantage is that there are some really fucked up sick individuals out there that access chatrooms to interfere & abuse kids,on the plus side its the gateway to meet new interesting exciting people...especially for me being a musician!Also i hate it that people can hack into our e-mail & retrieve valuable personal infomation from it. I destest that!!
While during the '80s a lot of printed fanzine were released, such as Decibel Of Death, Metal Forces, Thrash and Burn, Ripping Headaches, Violent Noize etc. nowadays are existing a lot of webzines, do you willingly read them?
I dont read a lot of them as some carry viruses & worms attached to advertisment,its not their fault its just the cheap net space that hackers can hack into.
Did the fanzines handle with VIRUS back then? Did they support the band?
Yeh we had a great response from fanzines back then, we used to do interviews over the phone & at gigs i remember a great one that did a piece on me they were called MUTILATED AT BIRTH...it just always stuck out in my mind that name..they were a great bunch of guys & were devoted fans!!
Didn't you think about to run, to do an official VIRUS site?
My web design skills are very limited i couldnt do it justice if i tried !!
How do you view downloading of music, which became a trend these days?
Its ok i guess, i do it myself so i have no room to complain about it...lol
Are you still in touch with the VIRUS members? What's up with them nowadays?
Ive recently got in touch with Damien (aka John D Hesse) after 18 years & he' will always remain one of my dearest friends, he still has a gardening business Tez has a tattoo business in Eastbourne & plays drums in HATEBALL a simple punk band (aww shame) As for Henry i couldnt give a fuck...no love lost there!!
A lot of bands returned these days, such as ONSLAUGHT, SABBAT or earlier, NECRODEATH, NUCLEAR ASSAULT, DEATH ANGEL, AGENT STEEL, METAL CHURCH etc. how do you view all of these reformations?
I think its fantastic that those guys have done that it shows their commitment & dedication to the genre,good luck to all of them,as i know some of those bands personally i think its really a credit to the music that theyve come out of retirement & i hear ONSLAUGHT are doing very well...i'm happy for them, they deserve it theyre a hardworking band ( i made my peace with them & SABBAT quite recently thru myspace..lol (what a wonderful invention) lol
What do you think about their comeback albums? Do they have to do with their classic records or do you consider them crap?
Ive never considered any of those bands crap & i never will, anyone who plays our type of music deserves the best praise they can get...its the most difficult of music to play & i salute them!!
As far as ONSLAUGHT, „Killing peace" became too modern for me, it hasn't anything to do with „The Force"…
very true i think maybe theyre tryin to keep up with the new bands like LAMB OF GOD & 36 CRAZYFISTS
Didn't you plan to reform VIRUS and hit the road again or record an album?
That may not be so far from the truth....how did you know this???i have told very few people about that!!!lol...all i can say is watch this space;)
Would you say that VIRUS is gone, buried, but not forgotten? Is the spirit of the band still alive, because the fans are keeping it alive?
The spirit of the band will always be alive as long as the fans remember!!gone??i wouldnt quite say that,as ive been in talks with some very old friends of mine my motto is 'never say never!!!
So Coke, thanks a lot for this interview, anything to add what I forgot to cover?
Nah i think you covered everything man!!!just remains for me to say thanx for compling this interview,glad to see there is still some people out there who appreciate us & remember us & are still very passionate about thrash & all its bands Thanx for gettin intouch with me dude let me know what you think of my answers ive been as accurate as i can be..........have you got some webzine or somethin thats gonna print this interview or is this just to satisfy your curiosity of what happened to us?? Keep in touch & let me know if ye need anymore info.